Jorge Martín Frías is the director of Fundación Disenso, the think tank of the VOX Party in Spain, and a Member of the European Parliament and the Patriots for Europe. The co-author of the 2020 book, La hora de España: una afirmación liberal-conservadora (Spain’s Hour: a Liberal-Conservative Affirmation), he has worked as a political consultant and advisor to numerous organizations. He was previously the head of training at the FAES (Foundation for Analysis and Social Studies) think tank. He holds a degree in philosophy from the Complutense University in Madrid and a master’s degree in political and institutional communications from Ortega y Gasset University Institute.
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In recent weeks several corruption scandals have emerged that allegedly tarnish the reputation of the Spanish Socialist Workers’ Party (PSOE). Do you think it will affect the Socialists electorally?
As far as I can see, it is very damaging for the party, but I wouldn’t dare to confirm that this could mean the end of the current government. If the institutions were not ‘kidnapped’ by the PSOE, this government should collapse in a very short time. Unfortunately, as the Spanish judicial institutions and many others have been controlled by the PSOE in collaboration with the Popular Party (PP), this will make it more difficult for the government to fall immediately, and it may not do so for a number of reasons.
It is a government that is in agony but one that has been given too much oxygen with an opposition (PP) that has been part of and complicit in its continued breathing.
Do you think that the complicity of the PP that you have mentioned can have electoral repercussions, as it has happened in other countries, whether in Austria with the FPÖ or in France with Le Pen? Could this can happen in Spain in the long term or is it more difficult there?
I think that it can happen, just not in the long term, but in the very long term. As for the Austrian or the French case, we cannot forget that they are political formations that have a long trajectory in the politics of their respective countries; that have gone through different moments and have managed to win elections; in the Spanish case, it will take time.
In Spain there is a media blackout regarding everything that Vox accomplishes; when Vox is right, it does not appear in the media, but when there is some kind of controversy, even if it is minimal, in the media what they do is they amplify it, as if it were a major issue.
‘In Spain there is a media blackout regarding everything that Vox accomplishes’
I believe that Vox and Santiago Abascal can govern Spain, but I do not think it will happen immediately. Spanish society is still a conservative society, not in the sense of moral or political conservatism, but in the sense that there is still a certain fear of change, so to speak. Not to mention the large clientelist networks that the PP and PSOE have in Spain, which are very consolidated. Still, it will happen at some point.
Last week we saw how Viktor Orbán was repeatedly attacked in Strasbourg. Why do you think he is so heavily criticized?
The first thing I have to say is that what we saw last week was a disgrace, although Orbán also got a lot of applause, much more than he would have received one or two years ago.
Orbán is the true reflection of the drift of the European Union or what they have turned the European Union into, which is the fact that a lady, Ursula Von der Leyen, who is in the service of the Prime Minister of Hungary, allowed herself the luxury of campaigning against him.
Orbán is a figure to be beaten by the European Commission, just as the Poles of PiS were, because he represents and reflects what many ordinary Europeans feel. So much so that the Commission is being forced to recognize it, as exemplified by the recommendation of the creation of immigrant centres outside European territory, that was suggested by Orbán in Strasbourg and was attacked and insulted by all political groups, except the Patriots and the ECR.
‘Orbán is a figure to be beaten by the European Commission…because he represents and reflects what many ordinary Europeans feel’
We look at Orbán with admiration for that work, for that capacity of resistance and for understanding that politics is not only a question of numbers, but a question of leading and being prepared for what is happening in Europe.
You have been the director of Fundación Disenso, a conservative think tank. Why do you think it has been so hard for Spain to even have a conservative think tank?
I believe that it has been difficult because there has been no political will, and because the major topics of narrative, ideas and projects have been assumed within the framework of the left. That is what has actually hindered the emergence of these organizations. Now, thanks to Vox and Santiago Abascal, who has always had the determination to think in the long term, it was decided to create a Foundation to have a space for conversation with politicians, journalists, academics; in which to have a conservative environment.
The most important thing is that it should not only be an academic space with its reports, which already exists, but that it should also take into account the cultural battle and that conservative events should be held to show ideas and how to combat the left. It has been understood that today’s problems are part of a global phenomenon, hence the importance of having a think tank in which the cultural battle could be fought in Spain, but that we could also do it outside, consolidating alliances.
How will the outcome of the US presidential election impact Europe in your view?
If Kamala Harris wins, she will continue in a more severe way what the Biden administration has started. Harris was somewhat controlled before, but if she governs, it will be worse, because her agenda is much more ideological, much more contrary to the interests of the middle and popular classes, and an agenda more linked to wokeism, which represents her union with the corporations, open borders, etc. What she would do would be to consolidate and expand what has happened in recent years with the Biden administration.
In contrast, Trump would represent a boost for conservative and patriotic forces. It is true that if Trump wins, the Commission, the Parliament will cry foul, as they are already doing so. Trump’s victory would be a great victory for the patriots against all others; not only against the left, but against those who call themselves centre-right and who are not, they are in fact a continuation of the left: we have already seen that the candidate of the EPP is indeed Kamala Harris.
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